Preventing myopia entry -- a animation.

Discussion in 'Optometry Archives' started by otisbrown, May 4, 2007.

  1. otisbrown

    otisbrown Guest

    Dear Parents,

    This vidio discusses the role you could play
    with a second-opinion optometrist in preventing
    entry into myopia -- in the first place.


    http://www.preventmyopia.org/flashanimation.html

    Take your time, understand the scientific issues,
    and work WITH your optometrist on this subject.

    And read the "Printer's Son" so you do
    not make the same mistake that man
    made for his child.

    Otis
     
    otisbrown, May 4, 2007
    #1
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  2. otisbrown

    otisbrown Guest

    I would also add the wretched habits of some (and perhaps
    many) children, of initially reading at a reasonable 13 inches (-3
    diopters),
    but then as a "lazy habit", leaning forward on to book, and
    reading and writing at 6 inches (-6.6 diopters) to 4 inches
    (-10 diopters) and even 3 inches (-13 diopter!).

    Yes the majority-opinion NEVER includes this issue in
    the discussion with a parent, and never checks either.

    http://www.geocities.com/otisbrown17268/ReadDist.html

    As with the "Printer's Son", this issue is FAR MORE IMPORTANT
    THAN THE PLUS -- OR ANY DISCUSSION OF THE PLUS.

    This is an issue that is, or can be under control of the
    parents and child -- if they HAVE THE INTEREST.

    In a way, this is similar to preventing obesity in children.

    The real issue is the motivation of the child.

    Not everyting in this world is, or can be under
    "medical control". Some issues require your
    understanding, and motivation.

    Just one man's opinion.

    Otis
     
    otisbrown, May 6, 2007
    #2
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  3. otisbrown

    Guest Guest


    Maybe you can use your "staircase" for this.
     
    Guest, May 6, 2007
    #3
  4. otisbrown

    p.clarkii Guest

    the "majority opinion" doctors (aka the doctors who follow the medical
    dictum supported by science) do not oppose children's excessively-
    short reading distance because that has never been demonstrated to
    have any effect on anything. just like using plus lenses to
    neutralize the accommodative influence of excessive near work has no
    effect on development of myopia. just like having myopes remove their
    glasses when they read has no effect on progression of myopia.

    and there is even a study where excessive amounts of minus power were
    given to children causing them to have to accommodate excessively all
    day long (how wretched!!) yet IT HAD NO EFFECT on myopia progression.

    so how can you seriously propose your theory of myopia progression in
    the face of all this contradicting evidence, which comes from a
    variety of different researchers scattered about in different
    laboratories throughout the world (so as to control for your
    "conspiracy" argument)? Okay, I can understand that initially you
    were unaware of all this data since you have no training in the field
    of vision research, but now you have been made fully aware with
    literature references, etc. Are you really such an irrational man?
    Its like you are looking at a dog, yet insisting its really a cat--
    even though it keeps barking and barking at you.

    to everyone else out there help me understand Otis. What
    psychological disorder is characterized by a person who does not
    accepting the truth, even though the evidence is quite overwhelming
    and obvious to all others? Otis, have you ever sought out
    professional counseling?
     
    p.clarkii, May 6, 2007
    #4
  5. otisbrown

    p.clarkii Guest

    i am unaware of evidence that changing reading distance affects myopia
    progression. and i certainly don't know ALL the literature. can you
    please pass along the reference to this work?

    thanks in advance
     
    p.clarkii, May 6, 2007
    #5
  6. otisbrown

    A.G.McDowell Guest

    Thanks very much for that. The correlation between reading distance and
    myopic progression is very interesting, since reading distance could, at
    least in theory, be modified after taking advice - although I suspect
    that a correlation of r=0.2 or so is more useful as a signpost than a
    treatment. Is there any experiment in which an intervention group of
    patients were advised that changing reading distance might slow the
    progression of their myopia? If this is true, it would be useful advice
    to hand out - of course, until such a study is done, it will be
    uncertain as to whether reading distance affects myopia progression or
    vice versa.
     
    A.G.McDowell, May 7, 2007
    #6
  7. otisbrown

    otisbrown Guest

    Dear Friend,

    Some ODs recognize the reading distance is critical FOR PREVENTION.

    Other ODs believe that environment has NO EFFECT on the
    refractive STATE of the natural eye.

    Here is a statement about how critical it is to prevent a child
    from leaning forward and reading at -13 diopters (3 inches).

    Enjoy,

    Otis

    +++++++++++++++


    Subject: Here is the statement of the "Harmon Distance"


    STRESS REDUCTION

    There is an intimate relationship between posture, working distance,
    desk surface and lenses. Pioneering experiments by Dr. Darrel Boyd
    Harmon and subsequent research by Drs. John Pierce and Steven
    Greenspan clearly prove a reduction of stress and improved
    performance when conditions are arranged properly for near-point
    visual activities. The following changes were observed: reduced heart
    rate, more regular and deeper breathing, and reduced neck muscle and
    overall body tension.

    To achieve these benefits the following must be arranged:

    Working Surface: A sloping working surface must be used that is
    tilted between 20 and 23 degrees from the horizontal.
    Posture: Seated comfortably, relatively erect, feet flat on floor or
    box.
    Working Distance: The "Harmon Distance" is the optimal distance from
    the eyes to the working surface. It is the distance from the elbow to
    the first knuckle. This can only be assured with a proper chair
    height to desk relationship.
    Nearpoint Lenses: A specific, low power prescription not used to
    correct a defect in the eyes but to put the eyes into better balance
    for near tasks. This enhances and integrates the posture, working
    distance, and surface relationship.


    Instructions for Visual Hygiene
    1. Do all near point activity at HARMON distance or slightly further.
    This is the distance from the center of the middle knuckle to the
    center of the elbow measured on the outside of the arm. Working at
    the Harmon distance reduces near point visual stress.

    2. Be AWARE of space between self and the page when reading. Also, be
    aware of things around and beyond the book.

    3. When reading, occasionally look off at a specific distant object
    and LET its details come into focus. Maintain awareness of other
    objects and details surrounding it. Do this at least at the end of
    each page.

    4. When studying, place a bookmark 3 or 4 pages ahead. Get up and
    move around for at least one minute each time you reach the bookmark.

    5. Sit UPRIGHT. Practice holding your back arched while you read and
    write. Avoid reading while lying on your stomach on the floor. Avoid
    reading in bed while lying on your stomach on the floor. Avoid
    reading in bed, unless sitting reasonably upright.

    6. Provide for adequate general illumination, as well as good central
    illumination, at the near task. The illumination on the task should
    be about three times that of the surrounding background.

    7. Tilt the book up about 20 degrees (this slopes up about 4 inches
    in 12). A tilt top for the desk can be made by screwing two door
    stops to the back of a piece of 1/2 inch plywood or a drawing board,
    and two rubber knobs to the near end so it doesn't slip off the desk.
    This can be used for reading, studying, writing. It usually enables
    working farther away from the task than when the task is flat on the
    desk.

    8. Do not sit any closer to TV than 6 to 8 feet, and be sure to sit
    upright. Maintain good posture.

    9. When riding in a vehicle, avoid reading and other near activity.
    Encourage looking at sights in the distance for interest and
    identification.

    10. Encourage outdoor play or sports activities that require seeing
    beyond arm's length.

    11. When outdoors, sight a distant object at about eye level. At the
    same time, be aware of where things are on all sides.

    12. Walk with head up, eyes wide open and look TOWARD, not at,
    objects.

    13. Become very conscious of the background of the objects you look
    TOWARD, be it a person, print on a page, an electric sign, the TV, or
    any other object.

    ++++++++

    Note: Harmon was a behaviorial optometrist (second-opinion).
    So now the majority-opinion ODs acknowledge that
    a very-close near enviroment is a problem for a child.

    Funny, then never say this until you suggest that
    the parent pay attntion to his child's reading "habits."

    Otis

    ++++++++++
     
    otisbrown, May 7, 2007
    #7
  8. otisbrown

    p.clarkii Guest

    MT, thanks for the reference.

    sure, it is quite clear that there is a correlation between near work
    and myopia. that's been known for decades. but going so far as to say
    that telling a child whom is reading at a distance that is "too close"
    to their reading material (according to someones arbitrary opinion),
    and that they should move back to some other preferable reading
    distance (again, someones arbitrarily-assigned distance), and that
    that change will reduce their risk of developing myopia, is going way
    too far. that's what my objection to Otis and his website link is
    about.

    but while I am already familiar with the Parssinen study, I don't
    remember the specifics that relate to the following part of the
    abstract you posted:
    "Myopic progression did not correlate positively with accommodation,
    but the shorter the average reading distance of the follow-up time the
    faster was the myopic progression ". that statement is hard to
    decipher but seems to suggest that the study actually DOES have some
    data showing that adjusting reading distance has value. i will have
    to dig up that article and reread it. maybe I am not as familiar with
    it as I thought.

    i was trained and employed as a Ph.D. biological researcher before I
    returned to opto school and became a clinician twelve years later. in
    general it takes solid scientific proof to make me embrace a treatment
    regimen. just suggesting something like "have your child move back
    from their reading material" or "sitting closer than 6 feet from the
    television is not advised" when there isn't any specific proof for
    those recommendations doesn't sit well with me. sounds kind of like
    old-line "behavioral optometry/OEP" type thinking to me and I am not
    an advocate of that type of practicing. perhaps that's what otis
    thinks of when he talks about "second-opinion" optometrists-- i.e.
    older-style optometrists who practice unproven methods just because
    they feel right but are untested and have never been subjected to
    scientific scrutiny.

    please don't come away feeling like I am trying to lump you into that
    latter group of optometrists. pointing out that there is a
    correlation between near work and myopia, which i realize is clear,
    does not mean that one can extrapolate that observation in to specific
    recommendations about optimal reading distances or TV viewing
    distances.
     
    p.clarkii, May 8, 2007
    #8
  9. otisbrown

    Ms.Brainy Guest

    Isn't it mixing up cause and effect?
     
    Ms.Brainy, May 8, 2007
    #9
  10. otisbrown

    p.clarkii Guest

    possibly so. but what he said is that there is a correlation, not a
    cause or an effect. a strong correlation can be used to infer cause,
    but it cannot prove it. only direct experimental evidence can
    demonstrate cause.

    regardless, even if a population of properly-corrected myopes were
    compared to non-myopes, I suspect you would still find that the
    corrected myopic group would engage in more near work than the non-
    myopic group. don't know if its been done.
     
    p.clarkii, May 8, 2007
    #10
  11. otisbrown

    Ms.Brainy Guest

    I tend to believe that children (and adults), myopes or not, corrected
    or not, will choose the distance that is most comfortable for them.
    In other words, their ability to see details clearly dictates their
    chosen distance, not the other way around.
     
    Ms.Brainy, May 8, 2007
    #11
  12. otisbrown

    Neil Brooks Guest

    Our buddy, Otis, likes to mention that "long-haul truck drivers don't
    tend to get myopia," to which I have consistently replied that,
    perhaps, myopes don't often go into long-haul trucking.

    Otis has a HUGE problem with constantly conflating correlation with
    causation.

    Among other things....
     
    Neil Brooks, May 8, 2007
    #12
  13. otisbrown

    p.clarkii Guest

    otis, please provide any proof that any of these recommendations has
    any basis in fact. is there any data to support them?
    we all know that the answer is NO. this is just a bunch of feel-good
    happy horseshit that a small group of retro-medical optometrists sat
    down and wrote out that has ZERO substance to it. what does vision
    have to do with good posture-- really otis. and why should anyone
    tilt their reading material at 20 degrees, rather than 17 degrees, or
    22 degrees.

    and perhaps they should have added some more important points to their
    recommendation-- like eating a good diet based upon the food pyramid.
    perhaps going to church on sundays would also promote good vision, as
    well as saying "please" and "thank you". I think that properly
    respecting your elders should definitely be on the list.

    by the way, you never have let us know what the results were of the
    study that you performed on myopia development. where is it
    published? how was it set up and what are the conclusions. i guess
    you just forgot to reply.
     
    p.clarkii, May 8, 2007
    #13
  14. otisbrown

    CatmanX Guest

    Once again you post while playing with yourself Cletis.

    Take your hand off, pull your pants up and go wash your underwear.
     
    CatmanX, May 9, 2007
    #14
  15. otisbrown

    otisbrown Guest

    Dear Catman,

    Do you think that all second-opinion ODs (for preveniton
    are WRONG)? And further to you object to
    Harmond's recommendation that children be
    prevented from reading a -10 diopters (4 inches)
    and for some -13 diopters (3 inches).

    Or do you consider that this has NO EFFECT on
    the refractive STATE of the natural eye.

    Please explain your majority-opinion position.

    What SPECIFICALLY do you object do in Dr. Harmon's
    scientific recommendations?

    Otis


    ++++++++

    Subject: Here is the statement of the "Harmon Distance"


    STRESS REDUCTION


    There is an intimate relationship between posture, working distance,
    desk surface and lenses. Pioneering experiments by Dr. Darrel Boyd
    Harmon and subsequent research by Drs. John Pierce and Steven
    Greenspan clearly prove a reduction of stress and improved
    performance when conditions are arranged properly for near-point
    visual activities. The following changes were observed: reduced heart
    rate, more regular and deeper breathing, and reduced neck muscle and
    overall body tension.


    To achieve these benefits the following must be arranged:


    Working Surface: A sloping working surface must be used that is
    tilted between 20 and 23 degrees from the horizontal.
    Posture: Seated comfortably, relatively erect, feet flat on floor or
    box.
    Working Distance: The "Harmon Distance" is the optimal distance from
    the eyes to the working surface. It is the distance from the elbow to
    the first knuckle. This can only be assured with a proper chair
    height to desk relationship.
    Nearpoint Lenses: A specific, low power prescription not used to
    correct a defect in the eyes but to put the eyes into better balance
    for near tasks. This enhances and integrates the posture, working
    distance, and surface relationship.


    Instructions for Visual Hygiene
    1. Do all near point activity at HARMON distance or slightly further.
    This is the distance from the center of the middle knuckle to the
    center of the elbow measured on the outside of the arm. Working at
    the Harmon distance reduces near point visual stress.


    2. Be AWARE of space between self and the page when reading. Also, be
    aware of things around and beyond the book.


    3. When reading, occasionally look off at a specific distant object
    and LET its details come into focus. Maintain awareness of other
    objects and details surrounding it. Do this at least at the end of
    each page.


    4. When studying, place a bookmark 3 or 4 pages ahead. Get up and
    move around for at least one minute each time you reach the bookmark.


    5. Sit UPRIGHT. Practice holding your back arched while you read and
    write. Avoid reading while lying on your stomach on the floor. Avoid
    reading in bed while lying on your stomach on the floor. Avoid
    reading in bed, unless sitting reasonably upright.


    6. Provide for adequate general illumination, as well as good central
    illumination, at the near task. The illumination on the task should
    be about three times that of the surrounding background.


    7. Tilt the book up about 20 degrees (this slopes up about 4 inches
    in 12). A tilt top for the desk can be made by screwing two door
    stops to the back of a piece of 1/2 inch plywood or a drawing board,
    and two rubber knobs to the near end so it doesn't slip off the desk.
    This can be used for reading, studying, writing. It usually enables
    working farther away from the task than when the task is flat on the
    desk.


    8. Do not sit any closer to TV than 6 to 8 feet, and be sure to sit
    upright. Maintain good posture.


    9. When riding in a vehicle, avoid reading and other near activity.
    Encourage looking at sights in the distance for interest and
    identification.


    10. Encourage outdoor play or sports activities that require seeing
    beyond arm's length.


    11. When outdoors, sight a distant object at about eye level. At the
    same time, be aware of where things are on all sides.


    12. Walk with head up, eyes wide open and look TOWARD, not at,
    objects.


    13. Become very conscious of the background of the objects you look
    TOWARD, be it a person, print on a page, an electric sign, the TV, or
    any other object.


    ++++++++


    Note: Harmon was a behaviorial optometrist (second-opinion).
    So now the majority-opinion ODs acknowledge that
    a very-close near enviroment is a problem for a child.


    Otis
     
    otisbrown, May 9, 2007
    #15
  16. otisbrown

    p.clarkii Guest

    ===================================================

    otis, please provide any proof that any of these 13 dumb
    recommendations has
    any basis in fact. is there any data to support them?
    we all know that the answer is NO. this is just a bunch of feel-good
    happy horseshit that a small group of retro-medical optometrists sat
    down and wrote out that has ZERO substance to it.

    what does vision have to do with good posture-- really otis. and why
    should anyone
    tilt their reading material at 20 degrees, rather than 17 degrees, or
    22 degrees.

    and perhaps they should have added some more important points to their
    recommendation-- like eating a good diet based upon the food pyramid.
    perhaps going to church on sundays would also promote good vision, as
    well as saying "please" and "thank you". I think that properly
    respecting your elders should definitely be on the list.

    by the way, you never have let us know what the results were of the
    study that you performed on myopia development. where is it
    published? how was it set up and what are the conclusions. i guess
    you just forgot to reply.
     
    p.clarkii, May 9, 2007
    #16
  17. otisbrown

    Neil Brooks Guest

    [Otis putting words in people's mouths snipped]
    Please explain why your niece, Joy, is a myope ... despite your
    intervention with the plus lens?

    Don't you love her, Uncle Otie??
     
    Neil Brooks, May 9, 2007
    #17
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